You’re listening to biz ninja entrepreneur radio. This show was created for entrepreneurs, business owners, marketers, and dreamers who want to learn from the experts of today and drastically shortcut their success to build a business that supports their dream lifestyle. Since 2011, Tyler Jorgensen has been interviewing business thought leaders from around the world, a serial entrepreneur himself, Tyler also shares his personal insights into what’s working in business today. Welcome to biz Ninja, entrepreneur radio.
Tyler Jorgenson 0:50
Welcome out to Biz Ninja entrepreneur radio. I am your host, Tyler Jorgensen. And today we have Justin Fenchel, who used to be here in Southern California. But coming to us today from Austin, Texas. And we’re going to talk about the wonderful world of entrepreneurship in the adult beverage space. And I’m super excited about this, because it’s not something I know a ton about. And I think that there’s a lot of… Anytime I learned to market in challenging or difficult spaces, I feel like it’s something we can apply to everywhere else. Welcome to the show, Justin.
Justin Fenchel 1:09
Yeah, no, it’s great to be here. Tyler, thanks so much for having me. And no question about it. The alcohol industry is something that’s I think, very fascinating to a lot of people, I think many of us are, are consumers of it, but don’t fully understand the mechanics of how to bring a product to market and everything that goes into it. It’s definitely different in that way. So excited to share our story.
Tyler Jorgenson 1:28
And we’re going to go through future proof the parent company, what you guys are doing with beatbox beverages. And we’re going to go through a lot of this, but I want to wind it back first, just When was the first time in your life that you realized you were an entrepreneur?
Justin Fenchel 1:43
Man, you know, there’s so much there, I think it goes back to, you know, my dad, he was a commercial loan officer for years and ended up being let go by the bank, he was that was at the time, you know what I would now call it little doing a little side hustle that he jumped into when I was 10 years old, you know, out of our garage at the house, you grew up in actually in Van Nuys, California, and seeing what he was doing and how he’s been growing into which the business still exists today. And I’ve always wanted to be an entrepreneur because of what he was able to do. But I remember a little… Things like, even when I was like six or seven years old, we were at the airport, and at the time like that you could rent carts for getting luggage off of the thing, right? And if you return them, you would get a quarter. So I would be sitting there, I’m like, what an opportunity. Like, everyone’s just leaving their carts forgetting about this quarter. And I wouldn’t be gathering all the carts and getting the quarters in my I’ve heard my mom say like, hey, you’re a little entrepreneur, doing those kinds of things, you know, burning CD, burning CDs in middle school and trying to sell them. You know, there are always other ways, but was always inspired by what my dad had done.
Tyler Jorgenson 2:50
I think that’s really cool. I think it’s funny, a lot of the Gen X entrepreneurs have a lot of that same story, right? Like, and I think it’s because entrepreneurs see the world differently. They see it as a world of opportunity. And so an entrepreneur sees like, hey, people are leaving money, I’m gonna go capture that opportunity where other people see it as like a chore or a task. So simple things in our childhood, separately like is what like the indicators of who has the entrepreneurial bug, right.
Justin Fenchel 3:17
And yeah, it’s like, you just have a way of being like that. They’re just little inefficiencies that whatever it is, across any industry, someone says, Wait a minute, that should be done better, or people are leaving money on the table, or I’m willing to do this because there’s this big opportunity for sure.
Tyler Jorgenson 3:34
Awesome. There’s a bit of a journey between, you know, burning CDs and selling them in middle school to running an alcoholic beverage company. Right. Like, what was your first big jump into the entrepreneurial space?
Justin Fenchel 3:45
Yeah, you know that it’s pretty funny. Actually, one of my I mean, my best friend and business partner still today and beatbox. And future proof Brad, Brad show tonight. So we grew up together, we’ve known each other since middle school. And we’ve always wanted to do something entrepreneurial. I remember, you know, there was the poker craze. So this was like in 2001 – 2002. And poker was just going nuts.
Tyler Jorgenson 4:07
Justin Fenchel 4:08
We were like, We were, you know, big into sports. And I was we were going to freshmen or college. And we’re like, well, what about doing like MLB or NBA or college licensed poker tables and poker chip sets and all that. So I actually went down the path and reached out to the MLB. And these different sports organizations and, of course, they send back this like a 1000 page document. And they’re like, half a million dollar upfront like payment for a license. And that idea was quickly squashed. But we try. We went down the path of source like, you know, trying to figure out how we’d source these poker chips and tables and you have no senses after that. So I was working. After college, I was an economics major and I worked in finance. I actually was an equity analyst for a wealth management firm for about five years and while there do after the poker chip idea failed Brad and I tried to start, you know, I was analyzing the financial markets and Apple had just come out with the App Store, like this was in 2008, you know, 2009. I thought this thing was really fascinating. Brad was working in entertainment for a media company and had partnerships with these developers and brands. And the idea was, you know, well, what if we partnered with developers who could build apps for brands that had no clue what this app store. I mean, Nike didn’t even have an app that right, it was so new. And we saw dollar signs, right. We weren’t necessarily passionate about the space. But like, we found this developer, we partnered with some pretty decent, you know, brands, a bunch of music artists and tried to create these apps. And so did that kind of on the side, I think I mean, I put like, $20,000 – $25,000 into this thing. Before we even tested it out. Right? It was like paying the developer to try to get these things done. And what was supposed to take six months to get to the App Store took a year and a half was over budget. Like, again, you’re trying to do on the side trying to make it work. And I think the most important lesson learned from that one was, we did it because we saw an opportunity not because we like loved the idea of making apps for this app store. And so we didn’t fully give us all I think we just didn’t really it wasn’t anything that we really But anyway, the apps generated like two grand in revenue, and it was like that was the end of that. But I think there were a lot of lessons learned for the next endeavor. But that was a big one that we jumped into, while we were both working full-time jobs.
Tyler Jorgenson 6:35
From that lesson, like how important to you like, do you think it is to have passion for whatever business you’re putting your energy into?
Justin Fenchel 6:42
If you’re trying to start a company, and you’re not passionate about what you’re doing? Just stop, just don’t do it? Like, it becomes your life, like, you are spending every waking hour thinking about it, you’re dreaming about it, you’re you’re executing on it? If you don’t love it, then what are you doing? Right? Like, yeah, you’re gonna burn out so fast, because it’s beginning to become such… I think a lot of people may be jumping like we did, right? It was like, we saw dollar signs, we see this big opportunity, or we think it’s gonna be easier than what we were doing before. And what none of that is true, right? Like, you’re doing it nonstop. It’s the most work you’ll ever do. You’re in control of your own destiny and a lot of ways and so you have to if you’re not doing it, no one else is.
Tyler Jorgenson 7:24
Yeah, I think most entrepreneurial ventures, there are always exceptions, but most take you really go backward for your first couple of years. That’s a huge thing that entrepreneurs have to realize is that it’s going to take time and energy. And so make sure to be smart about what opportunities because there is not a shortage. That’s right.
Justin Fenchel 7:41
To me, the ultimate definition of success is the ability to find something that you wake up every day excited to do. Good people, good air industry, you enjoy the difference you’re making whatever that is for you. Right and that you can make a good living doing it. Like doesn’t have to be you know, to be a billionaire. You don’t have to be a millionaire, you just have to have a good living. I think most people will tell you that a lot of times people that are billionaires or multimillionaires, they’re not even happy.
Tyler Jorgenson 8:08
Justin Fenchel 8:08
That’s not the end game. It’s got to be something that you give yourself the freedom to do something that you enjoy doing with good people around.
Tyler Jorgenson 8:16
I think that’s that was a big thing that I learned from like Tim Ferriss in the Four Hour Workweek, right is like lifestyle design isn’t necessarily about making millions, millions of dollars, it’s making sure that you have consistently more income than outflow, right? And that if you do that, then you can take that energy and say, okay, well, how do I, what’s the life I want to live? So you are you’ve launched beatbox beverages. And now you have like a parent company. You’ve got other brands and stuff behind that. How did you decide to go from licensed poker chips in from the App Store into you know what, I’m going to sell booze?
Justin Fenchel 8:51
So it goes back to I was in finance for about five years. I was 27. I didn’t want to do that for the rest of my life. So I was looking at what else could I do? And I ended up moving to Austin, Texas for the business school at the University of Texas. I knew I want to do something. I wanted to create something, you know, dive into entrepreneurship. I didn’t know what. But during that transition from LA finance job to Austin was when Brad and I had kind of talked about this idea for a party version of box wine. And this stemmed from just being at a wine bar in Santa Monica. And Brad going we need some wind energy like we need to because everyone was tired, right? We’re sleepy. winebar was a work event. Everyone was tired. We need some winergy. And when he visited me the first week I was in Austin, we were just talking about winergy like what would it be right and like this was right when Four Loko was out in 2011 1011. You had companies like you know Budweiser putting out blind Merida is Mike’s hard lemonade from organic brands like the what is now called the flavored malt beverage segment. And you add box wine to like we were drinking Franzia. For tailgates for kickball games or going to the beach, like box wine was always there in the millennial demographic. But it wasn’t marketed to the 80 million millennials that were going to be over 21. You know, in 2013. Whoa, I woke up the next day after just like flushing that out, we were just talking about winergy. And the fun names we had like Call a Cab, Zinfandel, Sauvignon Blanc Out like just crazy. I woke up the next day and was like, you know what I’m gonna take this on as, like a class project, I’m gonna run with it, see what happens nice. And that evolved many, many times like I can remember waking up so excited like in with my fresh financial background was putting together like our business plan, the people we would need and the money we would need and who we needed to talk to.
Tyler Jorgenson 10:44
Justin Fenchel 10:45
That’s where I met Amy, who’s you know, all of our co-founders and two other guys, Dan and Jason, who are no longer with us but with the four of us. And then Brad as well. We’re all kind of getting it going. And we just ran with it. You leverage all the resources of the business school, the professors, the resources and to get ideas and it evolved from wind energy into Well, it doesn’t need to be a wine if we want to make a flavored beverage. And so that was that. And then the other piece of it was our passion and me, certainly for music festivals. So I love music. I love music festivals, I went to my first major Music Festival in 2009, which was Bonnaroo. I then went to Coachella and Electric Daisy Carnival and Austin City Limits and you name it, I probably been to it. And being at those festivals with hundreds of 1000s of people all just sharing the same feeling of just like doesn’t matter your race, religion, sexual identity like you did, none of it mattered just having an amazing time with the people that matter to you the most. And what show you we’re gonna see next and what drinky we’re gonna get the bar next for three days until you had to go back to your you know, normal job. And how do you capture that? That moment that was expected the music connecting us all like the millennial, the Gen Z music globally? Like how do you capture that into a brand? And so ultimately, we landed on BeatBox Beverages in the original product was a five-liter bag and box in the shape of a boombox? Because it was the centerpiece of the party.
Tyler Jorgenson 12:13
Justin Fenchel 12:15
And in talking about our passion, like for me, I was always the one hosting the pre-parties hosting the after-parties. Like I love bringing people together and sharing good times. So this product was what we would have wanted, right? This is what we needed. Yes. You’re tired of drinking beer. We were moving to different alternatives to beer. And now you’ve seen it explode that that trend. This was like a product that we designed for us as 25-26-27-year-olds, because we used to drink it.
Tyler Jorgenson 12:45
You guys were already consuming the product. But you recognize because you were to go into business school and like you were entrepreneur at heart, you recognize we’re buying stuff that’s not marketed to us. That means there’s a gap, right? Like, doesn’t mean you have to go reinvent the product space, you can just create a positioning opportunity. Now I’m sure you guys have also done some really cool product innovations. But step one is just to do a better job marketing to this new demographic.
Justin Fenchel 13:08
It’s exactly right. And we would dig into Franzia, which is the leader in box wine, and the wine group, the parent company. And you look at Franzia, they were the number one selling wine in the world by volume it’s a five-liter box, it’s the very affordable price point, they do a lot of volume with it. They can’t pivot and market that product directly towards the younger demographic. They’re too big. It’s too out there. It’s like it would never happen. Run, that was the opportunity to make a flavored more fun version that we would want in that same format that we were already booked, that really synthesized it right there.
Tyler Jorgenson 13:39
So what were you have this idea? Right, you get in motion? What was the first roadblock that you hit? And how did you overcome it?
Justin Fenchel 13:46
Well, the first one was, so I think this is an important lesson that we learned is, you know, any time you’re entering a space, like again, we had no experience in the alcohol industry, not I started to tell a lot of my friends about what I was trying what I was going to do well, anyway, one of my buddies that I knew from college, he’s like, Oh, you know what, my sister went to law school with a guy that’s one of the top beverage alcohol law firms in the country. So I hit him up, and he’s like, yeah, you gave me an hour of time for free just to talk. And we said, this we want to do. He’s like, well, everything you want to do with energy is illegal. The names, the formulas you want to use like you just can’t do any of it. But he’s like, Well, here’s what you can do. Right? Like we wanted to make it then a spirits base, we wanted to vodka punch. Well, he’s like, well, and we go back to him. We’re so excited. All right, no more wine 1.25. Well, you can’t do that. You can’t put hard liquor in more than 1.75 liters. But he put us in touch with this company that developed this kind of high alcohol wine base that tastes like a bucket. So every time there was a roadblock, it was just talking to people, you know, googling lots of googling. There’s amazing what you can find on Google and all the wineries in Texas, understanding how they were doing it. So that was big, I think the biggest like… After we got through all of that, and the lesson we learned from the app development was, and Brad had read the book, The Lean Startup, right? The MVP. How do you do that in this and alcohol was we didn’t sink any significant dollars into this until we knew it was going to be a really good idea. And so that meant for us crowdsourcing the logos crowdsourcing box designs, putting stickers on cardboard boxes, we emptied Franzia bags, filled it up with Vaca crystal item food coloring, we would take like an 8% version, a 10% version, and 11% version of a lemon-lime flavor, a blue flavor this and we would go to a pool party, we went to a kickball game, we went to a tailgate, and we would put the boxes on the table, and we get a focus group of like, 15 to 20 people. And we would say go to the one you think looks the coolest. And then and tell us why…
Tyler Jorgenson 15:45
I like that kind of focus group like it, they get less effective, the more that the better the product is right?
You know, by the end of that, you lift the four boxes, and there’ll be one that was empty. And you would ask questions, well, why did you choose the 11%? Like, well, I want to drink something that’s high alcohol. Okay, cool. If you learned we got to be above 10%. And the price points and all that stuff we learned…
That’s really cool…
Justin Fenchel 16:10
through those lean, and it only costs us like five total, for everything for like to get all of the raw materials to get the LLC formed. And we would be at a pool party. And it was like the aha moment where you’d have 20 people in the pool would be coming over to the boxes, saying, Where is where can I go buy this right now trying to give us $20 bills to buy these boxes that we put together in our kitchen? And, you know, you’re like, well, because people got it. They’re like, holy shit. This is like box wine. But it’s, it’s not you know, and so it was cool to see that. And that gave us a lot of comments. So then partner with the flavor company, probably the biggest roadblock was Amy and I drove to the TA BC, and in this was now in 2012 – 2013. And we said, hey, this is our plan, we want to we want to outsource manufacturing, because we didn’t even know what that there were distribution and alcohol or how they were like, We want someone to make it for us. And then we want to bring it into the state of Texas. And then we want to go sell…
Tyler Jorgenson 17:08
Justin Fenchel 17:08
And they were like whoa, like one, you can’t sell it yourselves, you need a distributor and you can’t make it in the state of Texas it needs in order to bring it in from out of state you have to have a wholesaler. So you can’t do anything that you want to do. And we were really dejected because it was like, What do we do now. But again, figuring it out finding solutions. I remember we were driving back to from the meeting with the Texas Alcoholic Beverage Commission. That’s the tombs. So that runs alcohol in the state of Texas. And I said Amy, you know what, we’re gonna make it ourselves. And we’re gonna figure out how to make it. And we did it cost us like 12 grand for this little Breaking Bad set up in this little winery that we created in a commercial warehouse in North Austin 500 bucks a month to rent. And we got our first product out there on our own, we figured out the permits to become a winery in Texas. We figured out the formula, how to make it and we just did it.
Tyler Jorgenson 18:08
Yeah, I love you to summarize that out like with you figure it out, and you found solutions. And I think again, really highlighting that that is one of the core personality traits of an entrepreneur is you they don’t see roadblocks as final things. It’s like, okay, we can’t do that. So this like and I mean, you you could have easily left the attorney’s office at that attorney’s call. Same thing. This is too complicated. We’re not going to do much. No, okay, can’t do this, this and this, that means let’s go down this road, right. And so you decided you’re going to go get the permits going to become a whiner yourself, just go for it. When was the first minute like other than that pool party, because those are really good examples that you’re like, we have something this is going to take off.
Justin Fenchel 18:49
Our story is pretty unique. Because we launched in March 2013. We were still finishing up grad school. So we graduated in May 2013. And we got into a bunch of accounts a bunch, you know, at the time, it was a bunch like 30 accounts in between…
Tyler Jorgenson 19:03
That feels like a lot when you’re just getting started.
Justin Fenchel 19:05
You’re just getting started. I mean, we would, we were making it ourselves, it would take us we’d be going to class going to the warehouse and spending 10 hours making you know, 500 boxes, right? And then go putting on our cars and driving them to the stores. What you could do as a winery. That was one of the things we were able to do. I think it was when we saw the first few boxes sold, or we didn’t have to hand-sell them. Like you’d go in and we would basically be effectively giving the boxes to these stores. And then going in and doing tastings to sell them. Every one of the first you know 100 200 cases we sold were because we sold it to people. Yeah. But then you, when you’d go to the store and they, had just gotten 12 boxes and you come back and there was none. That was a very exciting moment that hey if some people are buying this without us having to do it.
Tyler Jorgenson 19:53
Yeah, I think that’s one of the great indicators of any business is once the business starts to do well without the founders’ momentum. Like, is this product selling? Is the market clearly seeing what this is and buying it without you sitting there doing a sales pitch? And yeah, that must have been pretty cool.
Justin Fenchel 20:08
It was cool. And our product was so different. It was tough. And we’ve gone through probably 50 packaging changes. And, you know, our from our initial feedback it was, you know, no one wanted a flavor name, right? It was like, Red Bull, what flavor is Red Bull like to be cool. It was like it just BeatBox. You know, there’s no flavor. But then, of course, you’re doing these tastings. And what’s the first question everybody asks what is it? What’s the flavor, and you realize Red Bull had a $300 million marketing budget to launch in the US. And that’s a little bit of a different ballgame. People want to know what the flavor is, right? So we learned all that stuff. But for us, I mean, we look to raise money in 2014, after we got picked up by a distributor and outsourced our manufacturing. But then we went on Shark Tank, like four months, five months later. So when you know, at the moment, kind of that big moment was when Mark Cuban on national TV, I invested a million dollars into our company. That was when it was like, holy shit. Like, it’s time to go. That’s when you know, Amy and Brad, were both working other jobs, and they quit and came full time.
Tyler Jorgenson 21:06
And what year was that?
Justin Fenchel 21:08
That was we filmed it in June 2014. And we aired in October 2014.
Tyler Jorgenson 21:15
Would you say that gives her significance like before Shark Tank after Shark Tank life of the company?
Justin Fenchel 21:21
Tyler Jorgenson 21:21
Was it that big of a fulcrum point where like it things took off? Or was it just another step?
Justin Fenchel 21:25
There was a… I think there was a before Shark Tank, there was an after Shark Tank. And then there was an after short?
Tyler Jorgenson 21:31
Well, obviously, I mean, we’re talking about seven years ago now. Right?
Justin Fenchel 21:33
Tyler Jorgenson 21:34
You have got a lot of iterations since then. Like, would you advise other people that are in this situation now to do the shark go through the Shark Tank experience?
Justin Fenchel 21:43
I mean, I think if you have an opportunity to pitch your brand in front of, you know, seven, 8 million viewers, you’d be insane not to take that opportunity.
Yeah, that’s going on Shark Tank. What about taking the investment?
Oh, I mean, we would not be where we are today without Mark Cuban behind our business, the ability to raise future rounds of funding by having his name attached to us the resources that he was able to provide at the start his brother now still on our board of directors, Jeff, even. So for us, that was fundamentally game-changing, I think.
Tyler Jorgenson 22:15
So where is beatbox? Now, like, now we’re zooming forward all the way up? We’ve been kind of through the beginning stages. It’s 2021. What are you guys doing right now? And what are your big goals for this year?
Justin Fenchel 22:27
Yeah, so we are now across 35 states with nearly 230 distribution partners. We launched the single-serve in 2017. That’s our main product. That’s like 95% of our sales. Now. We’re going to do over 14 and a half 15 million in revenue this year. We did 7 million last year on vbox. So we’ve doubled every year for the last three years. Well, more than double again, this year, we’re going viral on all sorts of social media platforms and the awareness. I think we had 50,000 – five-zero – unique visitors to our store locator in the last 30 days. This time last year, that number was like 8,000. So like 50,000 people, what is that almost 1,800 a day are going online and putting in their zip code to find the product. Yeah, I love it. You’re an eight-year overnight success. I’m loving it is what I always say, you know, it takes about 10 years to become an overnight sensation. And it’s funny to see the comments of people like, you know, where did this come from? Where is this been? And other people are like, What are you talking about? It’s been around for like since I was in college? Yeah, exactly. These people are 30. Now, so it’s just funny to see.
Tyler Jorgenson 23:34
But I think it’s fascinating because that’s just how the nature of virality is right? It’s like, there’s an initial group of followers. And then as it grows, each iteration is faster. So you’re doubling every year, but all of a sudden now, doubling 7 million is a lot more than doubling 1 million. Right? And so yeah, and then each one of those dollars is attached to a human that bought and consumed and knows your brand. And, and that’s just amazing in itself. I just think it’s so cool.
Justin Fenchel 24:00
We had 3.6 million individual beatboxes sold in 2020, which I thought was pretty neat. And then this year, that’ll be you know, seven and a half 8 million individual boxes bought. And we’re still only in 5% of the total, off-premise meaning not bars, not restaurants, just grocery stores, command stores, liquor stores, we were in 5% of what we could be in…
Tyler Jorgenson 24:23
Huge, huge market opportunities there…
Justin Fenchel 24:25
Huge market opportunity. We’ve our groove like I’d say this was after a shark tank. You know, we were with a big Wine and Spirits distributor when we came into Shark Tank. We were in 100 total locations in Texas when we went on the show. Well, in wine and spirits. You only need one distributor per state and this particular distributor cover 25 states and when we told them, you know, not really directly but like hey, there’s this person you might know in Dallas who might have a TV show that is going to be airing sometime in the next few months. We need to be ready. They wanted us to launch in all 25 states with them. But at the time, we had three founders and an intern, trying to launch 25 states in an extremely complex distribution, you know, industry. And with wine and spirits which Wine and Spirits distributors, our product was wine base, but people have had a really hard time understanding we are not a wine, right? It’s wine base, but it tastes like we are flavors are blue raspberry and bright. And fruit punch, they taste like Gatorade and vaca. Right. They’re delicious, but they’re not wine flavor. So Wine and Spirits distributors are used to selling high-end wines and high-end whiskeys and tequila are and selling it in the liquor stores, and then the fine restaurants and those areas. But we needed to be in the convenience stores. But we didn’t know that at the time, right. So we were launching through all Wine and Spirits with a product that they didn’t really understand. And that wasn’t in their wheelhouse in the wrong channel. Yep. Well, we had to pivot all the way back to pull out of all those states and relaunch again in 2018. With the beer distributors, who you know, the 7/ 11 buyer. Yeah, the best is like, Look, beer is a multi-billion dollar category. Wine is in the millions. So the beer industry…
Tyler Jorgenson 26:08
That’s the opportunity…
Justin Fenchel 26:09
Tyler Jorgenson 26:10
Alright, so as we’re here at the end of the show, this is my final question. Everyone that comes on the show is business is about building the life that you want, right? You don’t do all of this just because you love working 90 hours a week. What is one thing on your personal bucket list you’re gonna accomplish this year?
Justin Fenchel 26:23
I want to go I want to get back to music festivals
Tyler Jorgenson 26:26
There it is. If it’s not happening, you’re going to create one. That’s what I hear.
Justin Fenchel 26:31
Yeah, no, you know, they’re starting to come back. We’re getting a lot of inbound from different festivals that are saying, Hey, we’re going to be doing this in the fall. So I’m very excited to get back out to some major music festivals with It’s so fun to see our fans drinking our product like where it was designed to exist a moment it’s I’m super looking forward again.
Tyler Jorgenson 26:49
That’s gonna be super rewarding. Alright everyone, we really appreciate you tuning in. Please go learn more about Justin and BeatBox beverages. They’re on Instagram. They’re all over the socials. You can find them at beatbox beverages calm and Justin super-appreciate you coming out to the show and all of our Biz Ninjas wherever you’re listening, watching tuning in, or dialing in. It’s your turn to go out and do something.
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